# Zulip Chat Archive

## Stream: maths

### Topic: Newton Picard

#### Jeremy Avigad (Mar 07 2019 at 20:49):

@Patrick Massot @Jan-David Salchow I moved this from the *out_param again* thread. Newton-Picard looks great! It would be nice to have it in mathlib.

I agree with Patrick that before moving it to mathlib, we should think about whether the basic notions look the way we want them to. For example, `pos_real`

belongs in `real`

with `nnreal`

and `ennreal`

, and should probably be named `preal`

, to match `pnat`

(in the `data`

folder). For another thing, I wonder whether it will later cause problems to have `moreover`

be a token.

I don't have any recommendation as to how to use `deriv`

as a function or partial function. I tend to be conservative and wait until I have an application before adding something to the library. So, for example, my tendency would be to keep using `has_fderiv`

and `has_deriv`

until there is a good reason not to (for example, because they don't work well with calculations). And then that application will help us figure out what we want.

I do have some ideas as to how to make calculations with partial functions more palatable, and I am hoping to experiment with that soon.

Jan-David, is there a specific reason that Newton-Picard requires defining the space of differentiable maps? Or were you just experimenting with the definition?

#### Patrick Massot (Mar 07 2019 at 20:57):

I think what Jan-David wrote uses only the derivative of f at 0. The right-inverse assumptions are morally about the second derivative of f at zero, but the second derivative actually doesn't appear. This is a really technical stuff, relevant in situations where we actually don't want to try to handle more derivative. Jeremy, in the situation Jan-David has in mind, the equation f = 0 is a non-linear Cauchy-Riemann equation, on spaces of maps between manifolds, with some Sobolev regularity. This explain while this theorem looks a bit strange

#### Patrick Massot (Mar 07 2019 at 20:58):

But I can totally understand why he introduced differentiable maps. This is really the first move you want after defining `has_deriv`

#### Jan-David Salchow (Mar 07 2019 at 20:59):

I mainly introduce differentiable maps in this way, because it worked nicely for the operator norm

#### Patrick Massot (Mar 07 2019 at 20:59):

I think the mean value inequality is a much better test for this. Here we really need a differentiable function. It would also need some stuff specific to dimension 1 (the mean value theorem).

#### Patrick Massot (Mar 07 2019 at 21:02):

I don't understand the comment about the operator norm

#### Jan-David Salchow (Mar 07 2019 at 21:04):

Well, the last thing I did with lean was putting the structure of a normed linear space on the set of bounded linear operators between normed spaces

#### Patrick Massot (Mar 07 2019 at 21:04):

Yes, we know this

#### Jan-David Salchow (Mar 07 2019 at 21:04):

Since copy and paste of that definition almost worked, I used it as a domain for the differential

#### Jan-David Salchow (Mar 07 2019 at 21:04):

That's definitely more than necessary

#### Jan-David Salchow (Mar 07 2019 at 21:06):

But handy if you want the differential at zero

Last updated: May 11 2021 at 17:39 UTC