Zulip Chat Archive

Stream: Lean for teaching

Topic: Informalisation for teaching


Xander Mackay (Sep 16 2024 at 10:27):

Have any teachers used Lean to improve a mathematics course, without requiring the students themselves to learn Lean? I'm interested in how Lean might be used to improve a maths course while keeping it accessible to students with zero programming experience.

@Jeremy Avigad's "Mathematics and the formal turn" and @Patrick Massot's "Why formalize mathematics?" both mention the possibility of providing proofs where the reader can choose the level of detail, which could be great for students. @Kyle Miller's website contains some info and demos of a prototype of "informalization", but I gather the code hasn't been released yet.

I know there have been maths courses that teach Lean, but informalisation opens up the possibility of using Lean/mathlib in a more unobtrusive way, eg for generating/checking course notes.

I'm thinking of hacking together something along these lines myself. Are there any similar prototypes/ideas I should take a look at first?

Kevin Buzzard (Sep 16 2024 at 10:46):

I've used lean in a course to go through occasional proofs which I thought were nice to do in lean. I didn't introduce the software at all or talk about tactics, I just discussed how the infoview was changing as I typed more gobbledegook. I did short sessions in several classes and told people that if they had no idea what was going on then they could just read the proof in the printed notes.

Patrick Massot (Sep 16 2024 at 11:07):

This is definitely a target of the Informal Lean project, but unfortunately this project does not move as much as we would like.

Patrick Massot (Sep 16 2024 at 11:08):

About Kevin’s idea, you can also use the Verbose Lean library so that what is written in the proof script is also readable.

Xander Mackay (Sep 16 2024 at 11:13):

Patrick Massot said:

This is definitely a target of the Informal Lean project, but unfortunately this project does not move as much as we would like.

Where is this project, and how do I join? I want to help make it move!

Patrick Massot (Sep 16 2024 at 11:30):

It is not yet ready for external contribution. Unfortunately Kyle and I are always overwhelmed by other tasks and we didn’t manage to reach the point where we want external contributions.

Xander Mackay (Sep 16 2024 at 11:36):

Fair, I figured that might be the case. (Something something Mythical Man-Month, Brooks's law, etc.) I'll hack away at something similar myself, and see if I end up with anything worth sharing.


Last updated: May 02 2025 at 03:31 UTC